Session Start: Thu Feb 27 21:49:52 2003

Session Ident: #dbviz

[21:49] * Now talking in #dbviz

[21:49] * ChanServ sets mode: +ntr

[21:49] * ChanServ changes topic to ' (ChanServ)'

[21:49] * ChanServ sets mode: -o Sid

[21:49] -> *nickserv* identify Qetaeta1

[21:50] * Retrieving #dbviz info...

[21:53] * _Ross__ has joined #dbViz

[21:58] * SandraFaust has joined #dbviz

[21:59] <SandraFaust> Hi

[21:59] <Sid> Hi!

[21:59] <_Ross__> hiay!

[21:59] <Sid> How're you?

[21:59] * udaykale has joined #dbviz

[21:59] <SandraFaust> Good

[21:59] <Sid> Hi Uday

[21:59] <_Ross__> uday!!

[21:59] <SandraFaust> How about you?

[21:59] <Sid> ty-urd

[21:59] <udaykale> Hi there

[21:59] <_Ross__> sehr gut! Danke!

[22:00] <SandraFaust> Ja, ja!

[22:00] <udaykale> is there some language setting in IRC ;)

[22:00] <Sid> No, switch is on me, triggered by lack of sleep.

[22:01] <SandraFaust> So, when is the next homework due?

[22:01] <Sid> *shrug*

[22:01] <Sid> Syllabus says March 6.

[22:01] <SandraFaust> I am at the pace for 58 hours at work this week. :(

[22:01] <Sid> What a sucky birthday gift.

[22:01] * brians has joined #dbviz

[22:02] <Sid> Eew Sandra

[22:02] <SandraFaust> hey, my bday is on 12th

[22:02] <Sid> Ahh, so you get the exam for your birthday!

[22:02] <Sid> Ok, sucks to be you more.

[22:02] <SandraFaust> yes, beats the homework ;)

[22:03] * sobby has joined #dbviz

[22:03] <sobby> hi everyone

[22:03] <SandraFaust> hi

[22:03] <Sid> hi

[22:03] <sobby> brian did you get my email. regarding the database

[22:03] <sobby> config

[22:03] <brians> no, when did you send it

[22:04] <Sid> Yea, you get my reply?

[22:04] <sobby> no i didnt ...

[22:04] <brians> other brian, sorry

[22:04] <Sid> Sent it a few hours ago. Call me Sid. =)

[22:04] <sobby> ok..

[22:04] <brians> did everyone get my vacation note?

[22:04] <SandraFaust> yes, where are you going? :)

[22:05] <brians> golfing in mississippi

[22:05] <SandraFaust> we all envy you, ragerdless of your destination

[22:05] <_Ross__> yup.. btw, here's mine: gone 17-21

[22:05] <SandraFaust> ok, maybe not ;)

[22:05] <brians> it'll suck right when i get back

[22:05] <sobby> hey guys..you will have to excuse me today..

[22:05] <_Ross__> I'll be cruisin to mexico...sadly with a bunch of spring breakers

[22:05] <sobby> have some work have to leave now...

[22:05] <SandraFaust> :)) that can be fun

[22:05] <sobby> is it ok?

[22:05] <Sid> Tell me what happened with the Test PLan

[22:06] <Sid> Or send me an email by tomorrow please, Sobby

[22:06] <sobby> i am working on..it..

[22:06] <sobby> yes i will do it..

[22:06] <sobby> have a product release for monday..

[22:06] <sobby> you know how it is...

[22:06] <Sid> Yea, I have a code freeze monday.

[22:06] <sobby> QA is kind of at the bottom of the food chain..

[22:06] <sobby> so everyone is kind of after our a**

[22:07] <sobby> anyone take care everyone..

[22:07] <sobby> sorry again

[22:07] <Sid> later

[22:07] * sobby has quit IRC (Quit: )

[22:07] <Sid> Ok, so that scratches both recorders.

[22:07] <Sid> And we're missing both Larry and Jim.

[22:07] <_Ross__> grumble!

[22:07] <SandraFaust> I can take notes

[22:08] <Sid> Guess that nullifies my first item... =)

[22:08] <SandraFaust> let me just figure out how to capture the log

[22:08] <Sid> I can handle it. Thanks anyway Sandra

[22:08] <SandraFaust> ok

[22:08] <Sid> I was trying to come up with an iteration plan

[22:09] <Sid> and then I stopped, because I'm still having trouble estimating how long it'll take everyone to do stuff

[22:09] * larknox has joined #dbviz

[22:09] <larknox> Hello?

[22:09] <brians> hey

[22:09] <Sid> We've gotten started much slower than I planned.

[22:09] <Sid> I'm planning on declaring the end of Construction 1 next week.

[22:09] <SandraFaust> that kind of happened last semster too, things took off last month (not that that's right)

[22:10] <_Ross__> wow... and I so like construction...

[22:10] <Sid> So I would like everyone to be able to finish something "submittable" by the next meeting.

[22:10] <brians> they're a little crazier with these hw assigns this sem

[22:10] <SandraFaust> yes

[22:11] * jrarick has joined #dbviz

[22:11] <Sid> I'd be satisfied with a Use Case document at this point, which

[22:11] <Sid> shouldn't take more than a couple hours

[22:11] <jrarick> Hi everyone. Sorry I am late.

[22:11] <brians> hey

[22:11] <jrarick> I just got back from San Fran

[22:11] <Sid> (that's for those that aren't already doing something, Brian)

[22:12] <SandraFaust> what UC docs you need?

[22:12] <Sid> I'd like to just get UC's for the tasks that people are working on.

[22:12] <SandraFaust> I owe the auto lay out one, it should be on the site on Saturday

[22:13] <Sid> That'll be good, Sandra, thanks.

[22:13] <_Ross__> me undo redo!!!

[22:13] <Sid> Uday, could you pick up a use case and submit a Use Case doc by next Thurs?

[22:13] <larknox> I'm to update install - anything else?

[22:14] <udaykale> ok, i will try

[22:14] <udaykale> have a midterm next thur

[22:14] <jrarick> sid, I'll pick one up by next week

[22:14] <Sid> Well, either that or get that Test Plan finished, Jim.

[22:14] <Sid> Either would be fine.

[22:14] <jrarick> Ok

[22:15] <jrarick> No homework due, yahoo

[22:15] <Sid> Larry, if you can come up with a use case for either JavaWebStart or InstallAnywhere, that'd be good.

[22:15] <Sid> We'll go with one initially, then try to do the other later.

[22:15] <larknox> ok, do you want both?

[22:15] <larknox> ok

[22:16] <Sid> Alright, let's just run down status

[22:16] <larknox> InstallAnywhere looks promising, I need to hook it up to the rest of java somehow

[22:17] <Sid> Yea, I could imagine how it'd get screwed up with our funny configuration, but it'll prolly work well.

[22:17] <_Ross__> hey as CM I resent that

[22:17] <brians> danny dig like your cm though ross

[22:17] <Sid> *grin* As far as Im concerned, every Java CM that isn't all in one jar you can run is at least slightly funny

[22:18] <Sid> Funny != bad

[22:18] <Sid> Schoudel, how're you doing with that Apache SQL parser thingy?

[22:18] <brians> i tested further and its definitely a go

[22:19] <brians> i've started coding the interface

[22:19] <Sid> Ooh, good.

[22:19] <Sid> What can you finish in a week?

[22:19] <brians> i'll be out of town all next week

[22:19] <brians> so i guess nothing tangible

[22:19] <Sid> Oh, forgot. =) Ok

[22:20] <brians> give me a week after exam and I'll have something tangible

[22:20] <Sid> Ok

[22:20] <Sid> Jim, I guess you were out of town this week?

[22:20] <brians> it even kicks out our schema in xml

[22:21] <jrarick> yeah, unfortunately

[22:21] <jrarick> But no travel for the next few weeks.

[22:21] <jrarick> I can make serious headway on the testing

[22:21] <Sid> Ok, good.

[22:21] <Sid> How much are you putting in the Test Plan?

[22:22] <jrarick> As far as...

[22:22] <jrarick> What kind of time, what scope--what do you mean?

[22:22] <Sid> How much detail? General directions on how test cases should work? Testing procedures? Specific test cases?

[22:23] <jrarick> I would think specific test cases and procedures

[22:23] <jrarick> The article on testing mistakes

[22:23] <Sid> I mean by next week?

[22:23] <jrarick> I think at least general directions on how test cases should work

[22:24] <jrarick> and a few specific procedures

[22:24] <jrarick> detailed testing will take time

[22:24] <Sid> *nods*

[22:24] <Sid> Both making the tests and running them will definitely take time.

[22:24] <jrarick> I think I also need a list of which databases will be implemented

[22:25] <jrarick> Is that still flexible?

[22:25] <Sid> The architecture is. Our time and manpower isn't so. =)

[22:25] <Sid> I'm convinced we won't have time to do more than one database.

[22:25] <jrarick> okay

[22:25] <brians> i would agree

[22:26] <Sid> And that's going to be Oracle, since we collectively have the most experience in it

[22:26] <jrarick> sounds good

[22:26] <udaykale> can we have some machine in csil run an instance for common access

[22:27] <Sid> Prolly not

[22:27] <Sid> Oracle needs a lot of drive space. Much more than any of our quotas.

[22:27] <Sid> Sobby was working on setting one up.

[22:27] <Sid> He did, but he didn't give me the right connection info.

[22:27] <jrarick> sid, am I working with sobby on tests, or is he off on other things

[22:28] <Sid> Well, last I thought he was tasked to work with you on testing and also to get that Oracle thing up.

[22:28] <Sid> But he's rather busy at work, so...

[22:28] <jrarick> okay, I'll keep in touch with him

[22:29] <Sid> Sandra, how're you doing on that automatic diagram layout thingy?

[22:29] <SandraFaust> i'm learning the junit

[22:29] <SandraFaust> I'll problably have questions for ross

[22:29] <_Ross__> :)

[22:30] <SandraFaust> he likes questions ;)

[22:30] <Sid> =)

[22:30] <SandraFaust> i'm hoping to have a clear idea how to do it in a week if that's ok

[22:31] <Sid> The diagram layout?

[22:31] <SandraFaust> yes

[22:31] <SandraFaust> is that ok?

[22:31] <Sid> Youll get that Use Case doc done first?

[22:31] <SandraFaust> yes

[22:31] <Sid> Ok, then that'll be great if you can do both

[22:32] <SandraFaust> use case itself shouldn't take long

[22:32] <SandraFaust> realization will :)

[22:32] <Sid> Yea, gotta come up with the algorithm

[22:32] <Sid> Cool stuff. =)

[22:33] <SandraFaust> yes :)

[22:33] <SandraFaust> i'm planning on having an idea next week

[22:33] <Sid> *grins*

[22:33] <Sid> Ok, my turn. I mulled over the schedule more. And then I made an updated Use Case diagram

[22:34] <Sid> And I will eventually make that silly iteration plan document...

[22:35] <Sid> *writes notes*

[22:35] <Sid> Uday, what've you been up to?

[22:36] <udaykale> nothing much - was trying to setup oracle database and run my small program against it

[22:36] <Sid> What small program?

[22:37] <udaykale> the one i said last week, which connects with a db and gets tables and indexes info

[22:37] <Sid> Were you successful?

[22:38] <udaykale> ya, could get list of tables and indexes

[22:38] <udaykale> have to figure out a way to get foreign keys

[22:38] <udaykale> because those will be required to make connections right

[22:38] <Sid> Yes.

[22:39] <Sid> How're you finding out what tables to hit?

[22:39] <udaykale> thats about it - have to start up with a starter case

[22:39] <brians> you can with the data dictionary tables in oracle

[22:39] <udaykale> ya, basically from data dictionary

[22:39] <Sid> I meant, are you looking through documentation? Or asking Sobby, who claims to know a lot about it. Or Schoudel?

[22:40] <udaykale> i had asked sobby, but looks like he was busy with his work

[22:40] <udaykale> looked at documentation mostly

[22:41] <Sid> Ok. My original idea was to get Sobby to write the Oracle importer, since he seems to have the most experience.

[22:41] <Sid> He shouldn't need much help.

[22:41] <Sid> However,

[22:41] <udaykale> ok, i will start with the starters then...

[22:41] <Sid> If you want to work on the Oracle importer instead, I don't think

[22:41] <Sid> Sobby will mind working on something else.

[22:41] <Sid> But you need to tell me so I can come up with some sort of tasking plan.

[22:42] <udaykale> i think i was tasked with it, the first week

[22:42] <udaykale> anyways...

[22:42] <Sid> If you want to work on the Oracle importer, that's fine.

[22:42] <brians> i can help you with which tables to hit and so forth

[22:43] <udaykale> ok, i will work on it with sobby and schoudel and start the use case doc...

[22:43] <Sid> Ok.

[22:43] <Sid> We have a use case for importing from a database

[22:44] <Sid> It needs a revision

[22:44] <Sid> I don't think it's detailed enough for Oracle

[22:45] <udaykale> ya, i just looked at it - needs an update

[22:45] <Sid> Think you could do that by next meeting? It shouldn't be too hard since it's mostly there.

[22:45] <udaykale> ok

[22:46] <Sid> Ok, great

[22:46] <Sid> Ross, your turn. Tell us of Undoing and Redoing things...

[22:46] <_Ross__> yay!

[22:46] <_Ross__> ok, so I've set up the basic undo and redo mechanism for our app

[22:47] <_Ross__> ... I've also set up a csh development env if any uses unix...

[22:47] <_Ross__> If you update your source, you'll get all of the goods

[22:48] <_Ross__> while the basic functionality is there, you'll find some bugs since I havne't let the "undomanager" know about all of the actions

[22:48] <_Ross__> currently, only adding a table is undo/redoable

[22:48] <_Ross__> if you are ever doing any work with the gui, you'll need to set up your actions for undos and redos

[22:49] <_Ross__> they're done by extending AbstractUndoableEdit and adding the resulting class to the current undoManager

[22:49] <_Ross__> by calling JDBV.getInstance().undoableEditHappened

[22:49] <_Ross__> ();

[22:50] <_Ross__> Basically you can check out AddTableAction if you are curious how it works (pretty cool actually)

[22:50] <Sid> Ross, what's the general sequence of events that happens with an undo-able action?

[22:50] <Sid> Edit that: undo-able use case =)

[22:50] <_Ross__> ahh

[22:50] <_Ross__> here goes brief:

[22:50] <_Ross__> do your thing

[22:51] <_Ross__> instantiate an undoable edit

[22:51] <_Ross__> add it to the undoManager

[22:51] <_Ross__> that's id

[22:51] <_Ross__> t

[22:51] <Sid> Well, what's the 'undoable edit'?

[22:51] <_Ross__> now, when you click undo ("or ctrl-z

[22:51] <_Ross__> the UndoAction grabs the latest undoable edit an calls its undo function

[22:52] <_Ross__> it then adds the undoable edit to the redo queue

[22:52] <_Ross__> an undoable edit is basically any action you perform on the system which is not related to opening new diagrams

[22:53] <_Ross__> therefore, we'll be able to undo things like: moving tables, moving lines, adding columns, adding keys, deleteing tables... etc.

[22:53] <_Ross__> make sense?

[22:53] <Sid> And the undoableEdit stores the functions that actually 'do' the undo and redo operations.

[22:53] <_Ross__> yes

[22:54] <_Ross__> you basically package up all the functionality you need in these undoableEdits and add them to the undoManagers queue

[22:54] <Sid> And we have one undoManager for the application?

[22:54] <_Ross__> no no no!

[22:54] <_Ross__> there is one per diagram

[22:54] <_Ross__> ...however, we currently can only have one diagram :)

[22:54] <Sid> =)

[22:55] <_Ross__> I've taken care of automating the switching between which undoManager is currently active

[22:55] <_Ross__> i.e. which diagram you are trying to run the undo on

[22:55] <_Ross__> That's really it I guess

[22:56] <_Ross__> questions?

[22:56] <_Ross__> comments, concerns?

[22:56] <_Ross__> praise? :)

[22:56] <Sid> Well, the prof seems very gung-ho over having undo/redo functionality

[22:56] <Sid> because it means you can do withoout a lot of confirmation dialog boxes

[22:57] <Sid> Yea, so now that we've put everyone to sleep... *grin*

[22:57] <_Ross__> no no, not "we" just me

[22:57] <brians> its interesting, just slightly over my head at this point

[22:57] <SandraFaust> :)

[22:58] <larknox> We're awake!

[22:58] <SandraFaust> he is thinking about golfing ;)

[22:58] <Sid> Hehe

[22:58] <Sid> Ok, any other issues anyone wants to bring up?

[22:58] <_Ross__> It actually isn't too bad, if you look at the code it "should" make sense.... well after I add comments at least this weekend

[22:58] <brians> whoever is my partner for next hw, please bare with me

[22:59] <Sid> Whoever's your partner gets a free extension, right? =)

[22:59] <SandraFaust> when is that due btw?

[22:59] <brians> i would think so

[22:59] <Sid> March 6.

[22:59] <brians> no, like tuesday the 11th

[23:00] <udaykale> it is not out yet...

[23:00] <jrarick> There is no listing on the assignments page at all

[23:00] <Sid> Yea

[23:00] <brians> its not there yet thats why it has been extended

[23:00] <jrarick> Maybe because Johnson is out of town

[23:00] <Sid> Ahh, ok.

[23:00] <_Ross__> how were this weeks lectures?

[23:00] <Sid> Then we'll worry about splitting into pairs next week.

[23:00] <SandraFaust> whoever is going to be my partner i'll need to do it sooner than later, have too many things going on around 12th

[23:00] <brians> they weren't bad

[23:01] <brians> pay attention and take notes for the exam

[23:01] <Sid> Yea, Ross, not only should you pay attention but also take notes!

[23:01] <brians> maybe we shouldn't pair up, sandra!

[23:01] <_Ross__> too busy undoing!!!

[23:01] <Sid> And redoing...

[23:01] <Sid> Ok, guess that's it. Thanks for coming everyone

[23:01] <brians> how many undo's can we do?

[23:02] <_Ross__> nah.. to lasy to do things over again

[23:02] <_Ross__> infinate

[23:02] <_Ross__> ... or 10...depends on the level I set

[23:02] <brians> slick!!!

[23:02] <_Ross__> :)

[23:02] * Sid grins

[23:02] <SandraFaust> brain we can team up, but i can't leave it for 11th or 12th

[23:02] <brians> i cannot touch until the 10th most likely

[23:03] <brians> i guess we'll se what is says firt

[23:03] <brians> first

[23:03] <SandraFaust> how about if we team up and I start it sooner and you finish it up when you get back?

[23:03] <brians> if that's poss?

[23:04] <udaykale> guys, any updates required on the homepage - let me know...

[23:04] <SandraFaust> I don't think why it is not possible

[23:05] <brians> ok, keep me posted

[23:05] <SandraFaust> will you be checking mail?

[23:05] <brians> i may be able to get online but can't guarantee it, i know our cheap hotel doesn't

[23:06] <brians> i'll have to sneak into one of those cheesy internet cafes

[23:06] <SandraFaust> ok :)

[23:06] <Sid> I'll send the updated UC diagram to the web group

[23:07] <brians> if that's all then im out

[23:07] <larknox> Thanks - bye!

[23:07] <jrarick> good night all

[23:07] <brians> see ya in a few

[23:07] <udaykale> seeuall

[23:07] <_Ross__> tschus

[23:07] <Sid> later

[23:07] <SandraFaust> good night

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[23:08] * Disconnected

Session Close: Thu Feb 27 23:08:01 2003